Caveat: I am still in the process of taking pictures, while writing this, so excuse me if updates come after you have commented. So if you read this some time after, it may be that the comments and pictures get intermixed. I encourage you to read on though.
Ok, here is what I want to do. In the following I am going to present each pose I've made. But instead of taking a picture of a very well painted figure, I am giving the picture of the unit as a whole. I am a paint-by-the-numbers guy, or a put-on-paint guy, not a details painter.
First up:
A unit of Spearmen with cowhide shields.
I tried painting these two units, in 2 different schemes each. That is they have the same basic colors of their plumes, and cloth. It is, on the surface, an easy figure to paint, but there are several pitfalls. First is that the helmet is actually not supposed to be of bronze. Yes, the Minoans did have a sort of bronze helmet, but it was with bronze discs on leather, most likely. This is instead a boartusk helmet. So they should be some hue of white with brown leather showing in between the tusks. This proved too tough for me to paint. I did try, but the result was not pretty. I painted the helmet the light color (of the tusks) and then drybrushed brown of a medium hue. The result was a disaster. So I compromised. The 2nd part that is tough (at least for some) is that the shields are cow hide. This is tough for two reasons. First of all, they come engraved... but there is no way that 20 spearmen had the exact same shields in this case. Instead I freehanded these cow spots. I think I got around it ok. But the black color is too shiny. A problem with my black color. The other problem is that the drawings and wall paintings of shields all show the same thing. The "white" hide was the least dominant of the two. It should be white on a black background, not the opposite.
The colors chosen I found out by first googling and reading stuff about which colors they could produce, in clothes and what their wall paintings showed. The camera had flash on, so the colors are not represented correctly. They are darker. They plume of the "blue unit" is the color that the cloth has. So try to keep that in mind as you look at the pictures I am going to show. I unfortunately do not have a good light source that will allow me to take better pictures, without the flash. Notice also that some of the helmets are without plumes! This is not because of me, but because the figures I got were like that. I think that the mold might have swallowed them. :)
Another kind of unit of spearmen. These with a much bigger and a little more advanced cowhide shield. The rim is metal. The Minoans knew of copper, bronze, tin and silver, not to mention gold. So some of those colors are appropriate. Since bronze is what is strongest of the ones, and it is the bronze age, I assumed that they would be that too.
Again the choice of pattern has been made by engraving, and again I cheerfully ignored it :) The helmet again should have been of the boar tusk variety, and the shields again should have had reverse colors. I found the feet under the shield the most challenging of the figure to paint. It is fun experimenting with the shields and their cowhide spots. :)
These guys are naked, with the "sexy bits" covered by a discretely placed weapon sheath. I did not paint the arrow on the outstretched arm, of the figure, but I did paint its point. This is the first figure I am going to describe as having some rings around the arms. There are quite a few of them. Three... that is I suspect that the one on the left wrist (the outstreched arm) is really a leather protection, so that the bowstring won't hurt the wrist. I did not paint it like that. There are two ideas for these archers I did not follow. The first is that they could have some painted skin. I do that badly, but a plate in an Osprey book actually showed they had that. I found that perhaps this was too late in history for that, but I don't know for sure. The second avenue I could have gone down was decorating the sheath and bow case. I chose not to, opting for a more primitive look. Later Cretan archers would be famed for their skill... I don't know if these would be that.
These guys have a story too. Like the archers from before they could have had painted skin. They have Javelins/Throwing spears, not sure what entirely. They have three in total. Hands on these were hard to paint.. as the hand gripping the two spears are very stretched out, and probably wouldn't hold the spears very well. I missed the ring around one arm, and by the time I discovered they had them, I was too far through to do it on all the figures. Lazy I know! This marks the first time I use yellow on cloth as the main color. I should probably have done so more. The Minoans certainly used it in their plumes, which seem to have been colorful, as all their clothes were. The helmet here is actually not bronze, nor of the boar tusk variety. It is a leather cap of sorts. I did not know how to paint it, because the shade is sort of conic with circles around it... err... it could end up looking like a dogs droppings. I couldn't have them looking like that!
These guys, or rather Nobles most likely, were rich. The Dendra Armor they wear is enough evidence of this. It is in bronze, and covers them completely from neck to ankles. I would write head to toe, but their toes are unarmored... and their heads have, you guessed it, Boar tusk helmets. The shields are interesting. I did not paint them as I should have, if it was up to history. They would be decorated. Osprey shows one of them with silver and blue plating. That is why there are the stripes on them. They could be different of course, Minoans used a variety of colors. They even had access to Purple, which in other cases might be considered especially noble. I made their headdress crests simple. They were probably multicolored, not black at all, which I did avoid. They wanted to show off. So yellows, blues, whites, reds and purple are all relevant, even green might have been. One thing that I did not miss, but had me cursing when I painted them was that the Dendra Armor is made up of plates, and these plates have fabric inbetween them, maybe leather. I colored it nicely in different colors, each unit in their own. But painting so fine details is really beyond my skill. I tried! :) There is a little evidence that the bronze could have been painted in other colors. I've seen light metallic blue.
Here is one thing I could have wished for. More lighter armed troops. Having 20 of these guys, and only 20 of each of the other types seems a stretch. The set had 12 poses, and I ditched 4 of them, because they were civilian. One of them was even the "prince of lilies" that has been depicted elsewhere on the forum and is on the box front. As a painter of wargame figures, so many civilians are frustrating. What was also frustrating was the inability to "cut off some heads" to place other heads on the warrior figures, because they had long hair, and the poses in general did not allow for it, I think. That all being said, the Dendra Armored unit, is more likely to be a collection of heroes that went around the battlefield, fighting, maybe even in chariots. The idea that they were in a proto phalanx is nice, for a wargamer though, but I fear it is just a theory, not reality. Still the figure is great.
These are also warriors in Dendra Armor. Again, I chose to paint the padding in different colors, that seemed realistic. The shields are the large figure 8 type, that is most commonly associated with the Dendra wearing Warriors, for that matter many others. They have a sword, which is drawn. I chose to color it golden, instead of bronze. My thoughts on when to use golden instead of bronze. I would usually go for the golden color, representing a more shiny polished finish by warriors that cared about their weapons/armor/shields. Thus the shield rim, which might not have been metal at all, but hide, as there can be seen sowing lines on the shields, is painted golden. The armor bronze, to make contrast. Again cow hide. This figure does not have the engravings, and you could wonder why. Luckily though for me it does not. I was getting good at making these patterns I think.
Again these armors would only be worn by very rich people, in great physical shape. I saw no reason to think that the shield be very heavy by being bronze, or even clad in bronze with several layers of hide behind it. The vertical strip presented a little problem, to me, as I did not what to make of it, until I saw an Osprey drawing, that this figure is probably inspired by, and it had a metal one. I saw suggested it could be painted whitish. I think that might be a mistake. The figure, looks very nice from the back too, but, would seem strange to have a unit photographed from that angle. Helmet, well, you guess it, again, boar tusks.
The Royal Guardsmen. I'll explain later why I call it that.
These warriors wear a very intricate armor. Despite the initial look at the figure, it is quite complex to paint. I found the Osprey illustration for it. It has white leg protectors, probably supposed to be linen. I chose to paint them golden, because it seemed to me more decorative. But make a note of it if you paint it. You can make different rings around the legs another color, it doesn't have to be metal. The thing that made these very hard to paint is the chest armor. I think it is supposed to be linen too, in an armor you need to take over the head to wear, and tie together at the waist. In the illustration the armor has strips in red and white colors, but painting those is very tough, because they have metal discs on top of the armor too. These I painted bronze. I did attempt to paint these strips, or rather two or three of them on some figures, in another color. I experimented with painting the linen a bit light brown, a sandy color. This doesn't look good. The edges of the armor are painted as they are on the illustration a different color from the linen too.
Now why did I call them Royal guard. Because the illustration shows this figure, almost, the helmet is different (boar tusks on this one, again), and has more of the plumes/feathers you see on the "prince of lilies". It is not possible to see if the shield on that figure is decorated. So I chose to paint it golden. When in doubt... the inner part of the shield could have been painted a dull red, but I chose a dark chestnut brown. It is the same color I chose on each other shielded figure.
Finally we come to the last warrior figures of the set:
These are supposed to be Greek mercenaries. I use the word Greek, because they are from the mainland of what today is Greece. They are likely Achaean. They have a huge two handed axe as a weapon. It is double bladed, which PSR claims is not correct. They make the same claim for the Royal Guardsman. I think they are wrong, as I said. I have seen pictures/plates of these axes. They may have been ceremonial, indeed some sources suggest that the Minoans actually did not fight wars at all. I find that comment highly unlikely. That the armors and weapons that these figures have are no more than "props" in religious ceremonies and parades.
I was unable to find any picture/plates that showed these figures however. That is apart from those on this forum already. I could have painted the helmet a different color, I think, but it became golden. It was hard to paint the crest without painting the horns, and vice versa. This is not an historical problem, but a practical one. The crest is simply covered by the horns, and it becomes guesswork to see if you painted behind the horns, or hit the horns, instead of the crest, etc. There is a strange fold in the cloth beneath the armor, which might have a belt parting it from the cloth, but I first noticed that it could be that on one of the last figures I painted. Like I said, lazy! The fold could be armor, could be decoration, or just a fold. It is really hard to tell. Anyway, without access to any sources for the figure, I painted it like I felt it could have fit in with the rest.
Well look at that, we made it all the way through without any comments from others, interrupting the posts. :) Now I hope to hear from you. Do you agree in my choices. Do the findings I have made help you paint them later on? Maybe even Linear-A can weight in (Andreas?). In any case it has been fun painting most of them, and researching them. I did plan to fight a small battle between them and some Libyans, but now I have packed the painted figures safely away. Battle will have to wait for another day. :)
My friend Claus, your color choices are perfect. The painting is very beautiful (did you use wash?). As I said the figures I like best are the ones with the cowhide turreted shields. Now I noticed that you have painted different pieces of cowhide. I think it's your best work. BRAVO
The Minoans seem to disappear from history after 1450 B.C. Crete was recolonized by Greek Dorians after the Bronze Age. Therefore the Cretan archers of the classical and Hellenistic period must not have originated from the Minoans. One element that supports this is the fact that the Cretans of the Classical period spoke a different language than those of the Bronze Age.
Zitat von GeorgeDianelis im Beitrag #13Try to photograph in daylight. I say this about the flash problem. However, if you hadn't said it, I wouldn't have understood it.
Yes, I understand. I tried to as well. But here in the greys (overcast weather) of Denmark and with the way I shake a bit too much, the shutter speed is simply too slow, and my pictures turn out very out of focus. I have bought a camera stand. I guess I should use it :)
Zitat von GeorgeDianelis im Beitrag #15The Minoans seem to disappear from history after 1450 B.C. Crete was recolonized by Greek Dorians after the Bronze Age. Therefore the Cretan archers of the classical and Hellenistic period must not have originated from the Minoans. One element that supports this is the fact that the Cretans of the Classical period spoke a different language than those of the Bronze Age.
My comment was mostly made with the idea that since archery was common on Crete, it might have been that they had been better than the average artcher. I don't know, but it is worth a little curious passing thought.
In the Iliad, Homer uses the words: "Hellen", "Achaean", "Mycenaeos", "Danaos" to describe the same nation, the Greeks. In fact, the Mycenaeans or Achaeans were a Greek tribe, as were the Dorians, the Ionians, the Aeolians, etc.
Zitat von GeorgeDianelis im Beitrag #15The Minoans seem to disappear from history after 1450 B.C. Crete was recolonized by Greek Dorians after the Bronze Age. Therefore the Cretan archers of the classical and Hellenistic period must not have originated from the Minoans. One element that supports this is the fact that the Cretans of the Classical period spoke a different language than those of the Bronze Age.
My comment was mostly made with the idea that since archery was common on Crete, it might have been that they had been better than the average artcher. I don't know, but it is worth a little curious passing thought.
Zitat von GeorgeDianelis im Beitrag #18In the Iliad, Homer uses the words: "Hellen", "Achaean", "Mycenaeos", "Danaos" to describe the same nation, the Greeks. In fact, the Mycenaeans or Achaeans were a Greek tribe, as were the Dorians, the Ionians, the Aeolians, etc.
At this point it is a good opportunity to mention the following: The correct word for our nation is Hellens. Among us we are not called Greeks but Hellens.
Zitat von GeorgeDianelis im Beitrag #18In the Iliad, Homer uses the words: "Hellen", "Achaean", "Mycenaeos", "Danaos" to describe the same nation, the Greeks. In fact, the Mycenaeans or Achaeans were a Greek tribe, as were the Dorians, the Ionians, the Aeolians, etc.
At this point it is a good opportunity to mention the following: The correct word for our nation is Hellens. Among us we are not called Greeks but Hellens.
I will try to remember to call you Hellenic, as that is the Anglicisation, Greek is however very much ingrained.
super aufstellungen der figuren da sieht man wie das ausieht in der masse wirkilich schön an zusehen war ja auch ne menge arbeit die figuren zu bemalen weitere bilder von den figuren wären schön
LINEAR-A 
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16.03.2024 23:30
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Primus Pilus